33,665 + 3,275 vs. 900,000 -uws(United We Stand) @SF湾区华人论坛:SF湾区枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of San Francisco

33,665 + 3,275 vs. 900,000

uws(United We Stand)

Cumings, Bruce (2011). The Korean War: A History. Modern Library. p. 35. ISBN 9780812978964. Various encyclopedias state that the countries involved in the three-year conflict suffered a total of more than 4 million casualties, of which at least 2 million were civilians—a higher percentage than in World War II or Vietnam. A total of 36,940 Americans lost their lives in the Korean theater; of these, 33,665 were killed in action, while 3,275 died there of non-hostile causes. Some 92,134 Americans were wounded in action, and decades later, 8,176 were still reported as missing. South Korea sustained 1,312,836 casualties, including 415,004 dead. Casualties among other UN allies totaled 16,532, including 3,094 dead. Estimated North Korean casualties numbered 2 million, including about one million civilians and 520,000 soldiers. An estimated 900,000 Chinese soldiers lost their lives in combat.

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Last Updated: 2023-5-28
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对于中共来说，死多少人都不算什么 -**🍣; 2023-5-28 (#15453096@0) +1

你看美国人有吹嘘和宣传朝鲜战争吗？连电影都没有。从这就知道美国人心里这场战争是啥样了。 -**🐸; 2023-5-28 (#15453109@0) +2

There are many American movies based on Korean War: -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 {219} (#15453282@0) +1

Full Story:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Korean_War_films

吹嘘有吗？宣传有吗？ -firetrain(火车头); 2023-5-29 (#15453836@0)

知道美国有条驱逐舰命名为“长津湖号”吗？USS Chosin -headbig(Let's Rock！); 2023-5-29 {409} (#15454154@0)

Full Story:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Chosin

本来就是这样，辩证法的主要用处就是把黑的证明成白的。比如中国的大飞机，飞不起来就是十几个老总一起上飞机 -gta_palace(呄 - 每天乃古); 2023-5-28 (#15453116@0)

美军牺牲或失踪的每个军人，都有名字可查，刻在那里；看看志愿军牺牲或失踪的，名字呢？ -steven8888(夜太黑); 2023-5-28 (#15453126@0) +3

有哪位种田的会给每一颗韭菜取个名字，炒盘菜，附上各颗韭菜的名单？ -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 (#15453130@0) +1
中国没有吗？ -beam1(heavyheavy); 2023-6-2 (#15463473@0)

中国没有牺牲人员的总名单。在一些地方志里有个别零散的纪录。当时军队的档案还不够成熟，很多志愿军战士的档案是缺失或者错误的，例如黄继光，杨根思的名字都是错的。 -**🐭; 2023-6-2 (#15465037@0)

二次大战对苏联而言是一个标准的败仗：苏联二战共有2680万人死亡，其中正规军队死亡人数有890万人。德国二战死亡约800万人，其中士兵战死约600万，还不全是被苏军打死的 -haploidus(今剩叹); 2023-5-28 (#15453176@0)

苏德战争战损比最多1：3 吧。历史上哪个战争战损比达到1：30还敢自称胜利的？ -**🐭; 2023-5-28 (#15453228@0)

你那个数据根本是胡扯。且不论数字的准确性，拿一方死亡数字与另一方伤亡数字比，头脑有硬伤啊。 -haploidus(今剩叹); 2023-5-28 (#15453493@0)

胡说八道，美军死三万，这位怕是连华盛顿都没去玩过吧...志愿军死100万，这都不知道上哪被洗的脑. 战争中死亡的士兵，用“杀害”, 这属于无知到底了吧 -dayafterday(dream); 2023-5-28 (#15453266@0)

33,665 + 3,275 vs. 900,000 -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 {1722} (#15453332@0)
1. Cumings, Bruce (2011). The Korean War: A History. Modern Library. p. 35. ISBN 9780812978964. Various encyclopedias state that the countries involved in the three-year conflict suffered a total of more than 4 million casualties, of which at least 2 million were civilians—a higher percentage than in World War II or Vietnam. A total of 36,940 Americans lost their lives in the Korean theater; of these, 33,665 were killed in action, while 3,275 died there of non-hostile causes. Some 92,134 Americans were wounded in action, and decades later, 8,176 were still reported as missing. South Korea sustained 1,312,836 casualties, including 415,004 dead. Casualties among other UN allies totaled 16,532, including 3,094 dead. Estimated North Korean casualties numbered 2 million, including about one million civilians and 520,000 soldiers. An estimated 900,000 Chinese soldiers lost their lives in combat.

Bbc的数据 -dayafterday(dream); 2023-5-28 {327} (#15453403@0)
美国方面统计，在朝鲜战场上阵亡的中国人民志愿军为40万人以上、负伤48.6万人及被俘21839人。
相比之下，联合国军伤亡较轻，但也非常可观。联合国军共死亡57606人，伤病115183人，失踪及被俘6973人，总计179762人。其中，美军死亡54246人，占外国军队死亡总数的94.16%。
https://www.bbc.com/zhongwen/simp/world-53165066.amp

作者陈岩是谁？他的数据来源可能偏旧。因为后来美国发现数据统计出错，有一万多死亡是在朝鲜战场之外。 -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 (#15453412@0)

如果志愿军死亡90万，那么按通用的死伤比计，中国军队伤亡在300万以上。你说离谱吗 -dayafterday(dream); 2023-5-28 (#15453480@0)

已知的中共有些作法是很离谱的，比如把成建制的部队，只着单衣，送到冬天的朝鲜战场。斯大林都做不出来。 -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 (#15453501@0)

这里说数字。至于装备后勤的认知，在当时的泥腿子土共军队是个新东西，并非不把人命当回事，而是没有意识和相关知识，知耻后勇，后来入朝的军队就好多了。类似的中越战争，一开始也是非必要伤亡很大，后来总结经验，伤亡小多了 -dayafterday(dream); 2023-5-28 (#15453533@0)

第一，这个离谱的做法，直接导致了成建制的冻死，也就是你感觉的离谱的死亡数字。第二，中共是在东北开始发动大规模内战的，东北的气候你知道的。第三，什么样的天气穿什么衣服，是个人都知道。 -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 (#15453653@0)

90万伤亡有可能，中国总共到朝鲜战场的也不到3百万，这个历史学家看错数字了，大部分的西方史料都是说90万伤亡 -opulus(opulus); 2023-5-28 (#15453419@0)
且不论数字的准确性，拿一方死亡数字与另一方伤亡数字比，头脑有硬伤啊。 -haploidus(今剩叹); 2023-5-28 (#15453515@0)

Read the post. It's about the death numbers only. -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 (#15453654@0)

原文：“ An estimated 900,000 Chinese soldiers lost their lives in combat.”，估计有....在战斗中丧生，是“估计”！俺也有这本英文书，还有其它的中英文相关资料，交战双方伤亡人数在各书里不完全一样甚至差别很大... -see1see(Isee); 2023-5-28 (#15453537@0)

The reason is that China keep it as a black box. All numbers about China are estimate. It's impossible to be accurate. -uws(United We Stand); 2023-5-28 (#15453663@0)

中美双方统计方法和对死亡/伤亡/失踪/阵亡/战俘死亡/负伤多次重复计入等方面的界定不尽相同，统计结果有所不同并不奇怪。而且各方都有虚报的可能：美方忌惮民众对伤亡数字的敏感，韩军也可能故意夸大损失，以求战争补给... -see1see(Isee); 2023-5-29 (#15453756@0)

华盛顿韩战纪念碑的阵亡数字是错误的，包含了一万多非韩战的数据。 -**🐭; 2023-5-29 (#15453718@0)

说历史没必要匿名，匿名就有信口开河、胡说八道而不必承担ID信用的嫌疑.....有证据就拿出来，随口说谁都会！ -see1see(Isee); 2023-5-29 (#15453751@0)

匿名发历史数据帖，又拿不出实锤史料证据的，都要打一个问号？为何要匿名？怕什么？为何不拿出史料证据？如果这样，谁都可以匿名上来瞎说一番，反正谁也不知道是哪个ID，造谣都可以！ -see1see(Isee); 2023-5-29 (#15453760@0)

按照伤亡人数论战争胜负容易脱离现实。二战德国伤亡肯定少于苏联，越战中越南人肯定死的多。 -**🐸; 2023-5-29 (#15453834@0)

孟良崮战役，共军伤亡人数应该比国军多，战役结果是国军赢了？ -see1see(Isee); 2023-5-29 (#15453841@0)

我说的应该和你一个意思 -**🐸; 2023-5-29 (#15453847@0)

所以说，应该是以战争意图或目标的最终实现程度来论输赢的，伤亡人数只是战争的指标之一而非全部，单个局部战斗或许可以拿死人多少来说输赢，但不能作为整个战役或两军对垒最终输赢的判断标准... -see1see(Isee); 2023-5-29 (#15453859@0)

@San Francisco

33,665 + 3,275 vs. 900,000

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